Unlocatable or uncooperative owners on leases

I've seen on the TRRC site a couple of permits where the plat states that not everyone has signed the lease on a particular tract in the pool.

Do you think this means they probably couldnt find someone, or that the person just refused to sign?

And what is the situation then in regard to royalties?

If they are the non drillsite tract, they get nothing.

See here:

http://www.mineralrightsforum.com/profiles/blogs/pooling-in-texas-part-3

If you have not read part one and two, do that first and it will certainly make more sense to you.


I cant find Part 1 & 2 - are they under another heading?


Buddy Cotten said:

If they are the non drillsite tract, they get nothing.

See here:

http://www.mineralrightsforum.com/profiles/blogs/pooling-in-texas-p...

If you have not read part one and two, do that first and it will certainly make more sense to you.

Best,

Buddy Cotten

Mineral Management

They are hyperlinked in the very first part of the blog. Look for Rule of Capture and The Basics of Pooling in Texas. Then click on them.

Dear Brett,

Unless I totally misread the question, he was not asking about mineral co-tenants. He was, I think, asking about non-drillsite unleased or unpooled interests articulated in Form P-12 (certificate of pooling authority) which, as you know, has no title significance.

Dear Brent,

In my first reply, I said if they were not the drillsite, they get nothing and referred him to a 3 part series that I wrote on pooling in texas.

How much more of a teaching experience would you suggest that I make? All anybody had to do was read the blog and figure out how to use a hyperlink.

As to mineral co-tenancy law, I am more familiar than most. Both with the rights of the co-tenant and the accounting to the co-tenant, which has squat to do with the pooling transaction.

You have a 10% interest in a 50 acre tract. The other 90% choose to lease and their leases are pooled voluntarily under the terms of their leases and are non-drillsite tracts . The unleased 10% is not in the unit and gets nothing because they are not pooled - because they can't be without a pooling transaction.

Now, before overly sensitive, childish and paranoid people (and you surely know who you are) have their little hissie fit, I am not talking down to anybody or being rude or sarcastic.

I attempt to make my contributions relevant and accurate. As to filing "incomplete permit applications" the permits are for the most part totally within the regulations of the RRC for a drilling permit. If not, they are kicked back. Of course, it sounds like you are confusing a P-1 with a P-12. Can a P-12 be amended? Sure, all the time - when straggling lessors sign up. Does it affect title? Nope.

But who really cares?????? The ones who refuse to lease a non-drillsite minor interest is left out. The ones who lease a non-drillsite minor interest to a block buster is left out, unless the blockbuster flips the lease. Here is when they are not left out (as explained in my blog) - when it is primary production and you force your way in through a MIPA action or when you are in a fieldwide unit.

Then you have that nasty little rule of capture thing in Texas and the assumption that there is such a thing as equitable pooling in Texas, which there is not. So, if you can't get pooled, drill your own well.

Now, since you brought it up. Was anything I said inaccurate, in either my postings or my blogs on pooling in Texas? What is so terrifying? I will not shade the truth to make people feel real comfortable about their options. The truth of the matter is that most companies do want all mineral interest owners leased. If they cut someone out, they have made an enemy. They really don't want to do that....well there is at least one publicly traded company who seems to WANT to tick everybody in the whole country off.

"Think of this as a teachable moment Buddie and not a time to scare people with the whole "If they are the non drillsite tract, they get nothing" thing Landmen tend to say."

Maybe landmen say that because it is accurate. Non-pooled, non-drillsite tracts are not entitled to a share of production if the well is at a legal location.

Here is a link to Richard Merrill's pretty decent treatise on pooling in Texas.

http://www.fabioandmerrill.com/PracticeAreas/RLM%20Pooling%20Paper.pdf

Yes, I did in order to answer his question properly.

Dear Brent.

It has far exceeded my expectations.

Although it is a minor part of my business it is the most fulfilling.

Thanks for asking.


Brent Rowell said:

Buddie the Landman, are you giving advice to actual mineral owners on this site lol? How's that working out so far?

This PDF made a whole lot more sense.

I have been trying to make heads or tails if one or two undivided mineral rights owners or the executor of an estate can hold up drilling?

Drill site versus non-drill site is a bit confusing and how that affects our property. Our drill site would be on our property and our land is unsubdivided as well. Thanks again for the link !

Brent Rowell said:

Well, since there's so many variables involved I'd use an O&G Atty. Short of that, here's the best explanation

http://recenter.tamu.edu/pdf/843.pdf

Dear Brent,

I am not trying to pick on you, but the statement quoted below is incapable of interpretation, due to your unfamiliarity of oil and gas terms. If, by referring to a "drill-site unit", you really meant "drill site tract", then you are correct. If, by referring to "drill-site unit", you really meant "drilling unit" then you are not necessarily correct. If your interest is within the drilling unit (usually 40 acres for vertical wells) but not the drillsite tract, you get nada. If a Ruled 37 is needed and granted, the well gets drilled and your unleased interest still gets nada.

For the sake of education and edification, I am just trying to help out.


Brent Rowell said:


Also, if your a mineral owner within a "drill-site unit" and you refuse to sign a lease, here's something you should know but its rarely talked about. You'll get 100% of your royalties from the O&G company instead of the 18.25% - 25% you were first offered. The catch is that your cash would only start flowing, in this case, AFTER all well costs have been paid off (your proration included) which in some cases could be several years, in the case of a Haynesville Shale or Eagle Ford Shale well its less than 12months...This is one of the reasons we have bonus money per mineral acre, to make this more equitable for all parties involved.

I found more articles by this same attorney. He breaks down the process so that it is easier to understand for the common person. This is GOLDEN information for me and our family. I have already forwarded this link to the clan and they wanted me to express their thanks again !!! This site rocks.

Brent Rowell said:

Thanks Farrah, that Atty has a lot of good info.

Farrah G. Shepherd said:

This PDF made a whole lot more sense.

I have been trying to make heads or tails if one or two undivided mineral rights owners or the executor of an estate can hold up drilling?

Drill site versus non-drill site is a bit confusing and how that affects our property. Our drill site would be on our property and our land is unsubdivided as well. Thanks again for the link !

Brent Rowell said:

Well, since there's so many variables involved I'd use an O&G Atty. Short of that, here's the best explanation

http://recenter.tamu.edu/pdf/843.pdf

Dear Brent,

I did want to take this opportunity to wish you a Happy Birthday and hope that your life is peaceful and blessed.


Brent Rowell said:

I don't doubt for a moment that a landman giving advice, on the internet, to hundreds of mineral owners across north America, "exceeded your expectations," and holds many opportunities for someone such as yourself.

Buddy,

You are right-on and that's that.

And a general comment to the forum: Most landmen operate under a code of ethics which demand the landman to be fair and honest in his/her dealings with not just his/her client, but with the people with whom he/she deals. I find that landmen want to be helpful and assist the public with complicated oil and gas questions and this forum is a great place for oil and gas professionals and mineral owners to discuss issues. I just wish I had more time to spend on this site, but, my experience and focus my entire 31 year career has been on Texas titles and RRC rules. Many of the questions are from other states and the "rules of the game" in other states can vary widely from Texas rules. You are very generous with your time and your knowledge on this forum.

To Brent: If Buddy Cotten explains something, you can take it to the bank.

Best Regards,

Phil Sartin, CPL

"I consider a landman that offers "advice" to mineral owners on the internet, somewhat parasitic to say the least."

Brent,

Yes or No, Do you consider me a parasite?

Brent,

It's obvious that your arguments are from a person who knows not about which he speaks. Here are some points:

1) This is a thread about uneased interests. How does that automatically make a landman a liar when the situation is explained correctly? How does that benefit the landman? How does this make a landman unethical?

2) Do you know that a lease is VOIDABLE in Texas if the landowner, who executes a lease and who also relied upon information provided by the landman which later proves false? Lying to landowners will get you a ticket home real fast.

3) Members of local organizations and members of the AAPL do operate under a code of ethics. This is a fact. Not only does a landman have to be fair to the client, but with the landowners with whom the landman deals. What sapeint being cannot undertand that?

4) Information these days is instantly available to landowners through Internet forums, such as this one, so to rely upon one source of information is not going to happen these days. So, you're saying I can answer some landowner's question with false information on a public forum and he and others will sign my leases without further questions? What plant do you come from?

Could you tell me, please, what put a burr under your saddle blanket in regard to the credibility of landmen? Seriously, I'd like to hear your story.

I am a third generation landman. My dad gave me his name and he left me a sterling reputation associated with it. Although he died 37 years ago, I still have people who knew him approach me with good words about him. I have bought leases from the same people he dealt with. I have worked with the same clients he worked for. I have dealt with the same landowner attorneys he dealt with. I have burned no bridges. I feel that I could walk into any landowners home that my dad or I dealt with in the past and still deal with those owners.

Any sapient being can see that your arguments are very shallow or nonexistent and that you are wrong, in general. This is all I have to say about it.

Phil Sartin, CPL

Phil,

Well put. Not all landmen are perfect, just like no people are perfect. But this I know, he does not have the guts to come to our office to say it to our face.

Moderators, either get Brett back on his meds or bar him from the board before people start running away from this site.

And yet again, some problems certainly solve themselves.

Phil, he or a family member did not cut their best deal because other people got more or something. Somehow, their lack of negotiating ability caused them to turn their hostility outward rather than looking at the cause of their problem. Either that, or he was potty trained by his father at bayonet point.

Hard to believe that you challenge a person's guts and they say,"oh, i gonna go boycott" Does not sound like a Texan or a man to me. Come on down Brett, I will make you feel real welcome. I'll even pay your bus fare.

I bought copies of Buddy Cotton's lease addendum's and am way, way more than pleased and Impressed! If a mineral owner learns one little thing or get's only one lease addendum or wording it is worth far more than the cost.

Most oil company landmen feel as if the mineral interest a person owns belongs to their company. It's "their block" and the mineral owner should sign what ever documents they give them, take what ever they offer and be glad they get it. As far as my opinion about "block busters", more power to them. They increase the bonus money, royalty and lease terms. Competition is the "spice of life".

What's wrong with a mineral owner learning something or getting qualified help?

As far as the TAMU website on oil and gas leasing help and other things, it's not complete and not updated much. I have been looking at it for several year's.

I have learned over the year's that you should never stop learning something new. Who knows you might find out that you really did not know much of anything you thought you did!

Brent,

I've never seen a more juvenile display from the time you entered this forum. You have tried to belittle someone you don't even know. I don't know whether it is being done out of envy or jealousy. Buddy Cotten has more integrity than anyone I've ever met, other than my Dad. He is honest to a fault and bends over backwards to help people, sometimes without even charging them. He is extremely generous and if you met him without knowing who he was you would, I'm sure, like him. I've dealt with many landmen and most are honest and up front in their dealings unless they happen to work for that one company that does nothing but take advantage of people. Where are your credentials that you can call Buddy (That's with a "Y") down? It seems your mission coming here was to try to destroy Buddy's reputation. I can tell you, it won't work. Too many people in this forum know what a knowledgable, honest and forthright man he is. It's a shame your boycott didn't last as long as it takes to fix a hard boiled egg.

Yours,

Wes Luke

Brent Rowell said:

Buddy, Im not sure why your wanting to get physical? Im a little guy but if your serious about it, I guess I'll give you my number and when your in Nacogdoches/Henderson/Center area I'll meet you and try my best. When you beat me up, I promise I won't call the police. Its only fair I guess.

Buddy Cotten said:

And yet again, some problems certainly solve themselves.

Phil, he or a family member did not cut their best deal because other people got more or something. Somehow, their lack of negotiating ability caused them to turn their hostility outward rather than looking at the cause of their problem. Either that, or he was potty trained by his father at bayonet point.

Hard to believe that you challenge a person's guts and they say,"oh, i gonna go boycott" Does not sound like a Texan or a man to me. Come on down Brett, I will make you feel real welcome. I'll even pay your bus fare.