I inherited 2.9 acres in Section 10 5N 5W about 13 years ago and have leased the mineral rights over the years to different companies. The last lease expired in May and Camino approached me about leasing again since they are about to spud in that area this month. Their title opinion now says I own only 1.1 acres. I’ve asked the land man to find the discrepancy but so far he hasn’t been able to and hasn’t received any explanation back from the attorney. How can I find out if there is a problem with the title? I have the legal description but not a precise breakdown of the area.
I am having a similar problem with Camino with an override lease in Sec 12 6N 7W. They say we only have rights to 25% of the mineral in the 50 acres we have in the lease. The wording in the lease is clear that we have rights to all the minerals. We have owned this lease for 43 years and never had any issues before. I have ask them, repeatedly, for the documentation justifying the reduction but they just stonewall me.
RJ- Leases only specify gross acres, unless there is language in the spelling out how many net acres are being leased.
Todd M. Baker
You will probably have to hunt down your probate documents and go over the wording in them. Keep after them. It is possible that they are correct, but you could also be.
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You have probably owned the mineral rights for 43 years, but the “lease” is something different. Pull out your documentation that you received when you purchased or inherited the minerals. Ask Camino for a copy of the title paragraph that describes the discrepancy. They will not give you a copy of the entire title opinion, but if you ask nicely, they will sometimes give you the paragraph regarding yours that explains the title chain. Possible that there was an original owner that had 50 acres, but then gave 25% to each child upon death. A lease usually states the gross parcel size, not the individual net acres.
Hi Diane I may know the specifics on this acreage and why you are not being paid. I would need your legal description to make sure it involves the same acreage
Thanks, John. The legal description for both Camino and my previous lease are : SW/4, W/2 W/2 SE/4, SE/4 NW/4 SE/4.
I’d appreciate any advice you have!
Yes I know exactly what happened. Back around 1958 Clyde Wallace owned this and owed some money on a property in Custer county. The courts took the property in Custer, but it was insufficient to pay off what was owed. The court then entered a defeciency judgement and then took some of his minerals in Grady county. Clyde went and filed a bogus deed giving 25 acres to a bank in Alex. The deed was backdated to 1957and filed within a day if the judgment taking it from him Later a well was drilled in part of this and the part of the property under the well has a document filed by the bank that says they have no interest in the property under the well. No doubt it applied to the rest of the 25 acres They should have included the whole 25 acres that Clyde gave to the bank in Alex OK. In any case from looking at the bogus deed filed and the time of filing it was designed to thwart the court order. It appears to be a fake deed using a previously notarized deed that was cut and glued or taped. It’s obvious as there is about a quarter inch shift on the bottom half of the document. I bought a lease from Carolyn Burzio and paid her for the clouded part of her acreage. I guess Camino wanted to gamble that noone would quiet title it. I spoke to an attorney at the bank and she agreed there was clear chicanery, however since noone was around that knew what happened the bank will fight it. I figure it’s an easy win but it’s not worth it for me to pursue it. But for the mineral owners and larger lessors on that 25 acres, it might be a good investment. Many companies have leased over that including the 25 acres, as it was a clear attempt at denying the purchasers of that Sheriff’s deed
This rings a bell for me about similar issues in Section 15 that I own and have had some title issues with. Carolyn Burzio was my mother’s first cousin. So what is the best way to proceed on this, John? Get a title attorney in Oklahoma to clear it up? I still can’t get any word back from Camino’s attorneys as to what happened. Thanks for your help!
I have a lawyer I used in a quiet title in Chickasha a few months ago. She could probably advise you on this Her name is Margaret Kerr I have some documents if you want me to email them to you. I can also give her a call if you want.
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John, that would be great if you could talk to her. I tried to reply earlier to you with my email address so you could send me those documents but it looks like the administrator has not approved that post yet – maybe because I included the email address? So I’m not sure how to send that over to you.
I’m a landman I should be able to find your number and unless I’ve lost my touch, I’ll call you tomorrow.
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Great! I’m in Boulder, Colorado.
Diane, you can always request the landman to provide supporting documents evidencing the chain of title in and to you. He has it to be able to get to the 1.1 he says you have, so he should have it available, right in front of him. . Also, you can have language in your lease that states if it is discovered you own more than the amount paid to you, that they pay you with X days. I have always had in my lease to receive a copy of the title opinion on my lands or at least that portion that covers my interest. So much, so little time. W.
Definitely have a landman research it for you. We own an ORRI north of your area and Camino’s landman said we only had about a third of our actual acreage. Not to be disparaging, but some times landmen companies try to buy at a lesser rate or acreage and then they keep the balance when they flip it to the company. I’m not saying that is the case here, just to do your own research.
Thanks, Jay. I’ll definitely look into that, too.